Evolving.
Fiance and I went in for first ever pre-marital counseling session. First the nice bald man poked gently at our history, asking where we met, how we started dating, etc. That was fine and dandy and then he asked about the engagement. We both told the story, fiance deferring to me at one point because "I tell it better," says he.

Then the counselor starts rifling through what turns out to be an invasive list of personal questions. I wanted to hide under the cushions on the couch.

"Well," he says, looking at me, "looks like you're the traffic controller of the relationship. Just an observation."

There's no denying that fiance is phlegmatic and I'm . . . uh, not. No denying that, but I hate, hate, hate the idea that I would in any way control him. I hate controlling anyone--I'm all for the individual's right to decide what s/h/it wants to do with life, and that's probably due to the fact that I hate other people trying to control my life.

Post session, I asked fiance what he thought. "Oh yeah, you do that, but I don't mind."

(insert foot-stomping whine here)

Is it possible that phlegmatic people don't mind being directed by other people? And does that mean we're doomed, he to a nagging wife for the rest of his life and I to the likeness of a traffic light? That sucks. I'm going to turn out like that woman in the Phillips laxative commercials.

And here I was thinking premarital counseling was going to help. I don't want to face myself.

(insert another whine)

(goes off and cries, realizing that self is not as mature as self should be)

Comments
on Mar 02, 2004
Find solace in the fact that you're mature enough to admit your faults. When we can do that, we open ourselves up to all the good stuff in life, instead of faking our way through it. Stick it out, the hardest things to do are always the most rewarding.

Trust me.

Trinitie
on Mar 02, 2004
It must be a state of quasi-maturity, then; I can admit my faults but not very maturely.

Thanks. Cheers.
on Mar 02, 2004
Being in charge is not wrong even if you are a woman. He will resent you for it eventually, so make sure that you ask his opinion before you make any major decisions. If he says to you--you decide tell him, that you want to know his opinion, anyway. Eventually he will tell you what he wants. Usually this type of guy is always happy no matter what and doesn't want to be bothered. Just insist its important that you want his opinion. I know because I have this sort of husband.
on Mar 03, 2004
Admitting you have faults, whether you do it "maturely" or not, is very hard.
And also, very admirable.
Hardest thing to do is look into that mirror under harsh light. OUCH.
Be proud of yourself for attempting to walk that road.
And don't beat yourself up too much.
It's all part of the crazy journey that is life.
Chin up!


on Mar 03, 2004
I think by your tone you are actually comfortable with it. I mean - come on - you're blogging about it and you are joking about it (foot stomping whine). So... all is good...

I would wager, and you can ask him - when he says "I don't mind" - is that because he feels for really important things, he either gets his way, or you listen to him.

So.. in a sense you are two perfectly matched pieces in a puzzle, and your personality compliments him.

Well.. I'm not a counsellor, so I will stop now.
on Mar 03, 2004

if the shoe fits, wear it. Then decide if it's comfortable or not. if it ain't comfy, get a new pair. if it is comfy, wear it proudly. I'm sure that your fiance' will say that the shoes go well with the outfit in question...
on Mar 03, 2004
Yeah, poetphilosopher, you're right on with my tone. He and I go together like yin and yang--exactly opposite but hey, it fits.

-T.
on Mar 03, 2004
It's a good analogy including the little part of the other person that lives in your head but shows thru.
on Mar 03, 2004
Oh! I always wondered what that part meant. Wow. Puzzle.... Pieces.... all coming together.

(I swear I'm not blonde or dumb, and have at least once had a constructive debate about yin and yang in literature in a symbolic way, but I never knew what those little dots meant.)
on Mar 03, 2004
I don't post much, but I hope you don't mind if I jump in. For my point, let me start with a hypothetical dialogue between two women, say Carol and Jane

Carol: My husband and I went out to eat last night.
Jane: Nice! Where'd ya go?
Carol: Well I suggested Macaroni Grill. He didn't offer any alternatives and mumbled, "That's fine.", so we went there.
Jane: Oh my god Carol, you're turning into such a control freak!
Carol: What?
Jane: You just don't see it. You really should have gotten his opinion on it.
Carol: What the..? I did! He had his chance to say something - I didn't muzzle the guy.
Jane: Well, just because he wasn't vocal about it doesn't mean he didn't secretly disagree with you.
Carol: Uh, look - I would have considered anything he mentioned, but he was ok with my choice - what's the problem, here?
Jane: The proooooblem is you've got to get his input even if you have to drag it out of him. Otherwise you're just controlling him, and he'll eventually resent you for it.
Carol: What planet are you from? I didn't control him - I made a suggestion and he went for it.
Jane: I'm sorry Carol, you're just another closet control freak in denial..

Ok, so where am I going with this? My point is that the line between control and suggestion (nag being the ugly form), is sometimes blurred, although it shouldn't be. If you think about it, it's very difficult to actually "control" what anyone does, beyond physically forcing them to do something. However, through suggestion we often influence other's decisions, especially in a relationship where one partner is more say.. indifferent and the other is more passionate about what they want.

In such a case (which probably happens alot, I think it's a mistake to assume there is a relationship crime being committed if more often than not the passionate one gets their way. Many times I think the indifferent of the two is happy to be absolved of the thinking necessary to make some of those decisions. It also can be very situational. Perhaps a husband has not a care in the world what's for dinner or where, but is very clear about how he wants the garage laid out.

This is not to say there's no potential for relationship wrong-doing here. The potential for criminal behavior is when the more vocal of a pair never/rarely stops yapping to give the other the floor so he (or she) can put their 2 cents in. I have seen this too in my brief tenure and that is not pretty either. The vocal one may have the gift of gab but will score huge points with Silent Bob by making sure he always has a chance to weigh in.

You mentioned another interesting word: nag. I define nag: asking/telling someone to do something he/she is already aware of. Since you already have a fear of it, I think you've won half the battle as far as I'm concerned. Nagging is a curious sitiation though, because when I've seen it, almost always the nagger is just as capable of doing the nag item as the naggee - the nagger just doesn't want to do it. I think if many naggers would just get off their a** and do it themselves, it would solve many problems.

My humble 2 cents,

Schro